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― Artistic Expression Critique'All Along the Fence Line' (A Composite)

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davechinn
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Re: 'All Along the Fence Line' (A Composite)

Post by davechinn » Tue Aug 29, 2017 10:16 am

Duck wrote:
davechinn wrote:[...] Here is my theory on the lighting and I may be completely off base, but you and others are correct about the direction, but my thoughts were, what if a flash/speed light were used to simulate the lighting on the cowboy, rather than all natural light? Similar results? Not totally convinced myself, but that's kinda my thinking. Am I incorrect? Direction of lighting is still something I need to work on and maybe someday soon I will master it, but until then I rely on others to point me in the proper direction. [...]

When mixing flash with natural light it is often prefered to match the direction of the strobe light with the natural light (keeping in mind that the purpose is to open shadows on the subject) so that it doesn't look unnatural or obvious. There are some photographers that effectively go against this in their work but they are able to achieve a certain balance with the look. In the case of this composite we assume several things and one of them is that we are outdoors without additional light sources (why would a cowboy have a flash?). Specially since a more obvious light source is shown to us. There is an incongruity of lighting as seen by the viewer.



I understand your theory and while I'm on the fence I still tend to lean both ways. I appreciate your comments and thoughts concerning this composite. I'm sure this won't be the last conversation in regards to lighting. I'm always willing to keep an open mind, because I hope to someday .... soon, master the issue. Thanks again, much appreciated.
Dave
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Don’t shoot what it looks like. Shoot what it feels like.
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Post by davechinn » Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:17 am

minniev wrote:
davechinn wrote:After posting an image of a sunset with a leading fence line, I decided the image needed just a little bit more in the scene. I had various subjects in mind but some were not as appropriate for the environment. My main problem is I'm torn between color and B&W (sepia in this case) so I'll have you decide, but that may not help me with a decision, either way I'm happy with both.
Dave

Very effective image, with well done compositing. I'll register a vote for the color version, which is still in a pretty restricted color palette that has its own impact. As some others have pointed out, there's some halo stuff going on with the edges that would benefit from some attention, but given their type, they shouldn't be difficult to get rid of. You've taken a photo of an interesting man and an interesting fence and multiplied the interest of both of them exponentially.



Thank you Minnie !!! Haloing is an issue I have had and need to watch closer. It's not there at the beginning of my process, but towards the end it is. Something I have overlooked and then the reminders come in. Sometimes I'll have several versions of the same composite, where I have made the correction on one but not the other. I think my intention of having several versions is to eventually delete the ones without the corrections. Sounds as though I have created a monster for myself and I need to develop a more efficient process.
Dave
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Don’t shoot what it looks like. Shoot what it feels like.
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Post by Duck » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:04 pm

davechinn wrote:Thank you Minnie !!! Haloing is an issue I have had and need to watch closer. It's not there at the beginning of my process, but towards the end it is. Something I have overlooked and then the reminders come in. Sometimes I'll have several versions of the same composite, where I have made the correction on one but not the other. I think my intention of having several versions is to eventually delete the ones without the corrections. Sounds as though I have created a monster for myself and I need to develop a more efficient process.
Dave

I'll assume you're using Photoshop for these composites. From my experience I have found that layer order can often wreak havoc. One trick that a retoucher friend of mine gave me a while back was to keep global changes higher in the stack while more local changes get applied towards the bottom of the stack. Here is an example of what I mean;

If you've ever done spot removal or dodging and burning on a separate layer you may have encountered this. You have your original layer and apply a curves adjustment to it. You then do a color adjustment layer and then some spot removal and dodging and burning on top of that. Later on you make some more changes which requires a modification to the lower curves layer. Suddenly every single spot you meticulously worked on removing become obvious brushed blotches on the image. A simple fix is to move the spot removal layer (local adjustment) below the curves layer (global adjustment) and voila, it's fixed.

In your case you have to keep in mind that a slight feathering to your masks will have a short transition between 100% effect to 0% effect (black to white). That transition through the grays is what causes the haloing and will react differently depending on the effect applied above or below that layer. In many cases it can be easily corrected by simply moving a layer up or down or by shifting the mask edge to compensate.

Hope this may be of help.
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Post by davechinn » Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:37 am

Duck wrote:
davechinn wrote:Thank you Minnie !!! Haloing is an issue I have had and need to watch closer. It's not there at the beginning of my process, but towards the end it is. Something I have overlooked and then the reminders come in. Sometimes I'll have several versions of the same composite, where I have made the correction on one but not the other. I think my intention of having several versions is to eventually delete the ones without the corrections. Sounds as though I have created a monster for myself and I need to develop a more efficient process.
Dave

I'll assume you're using Photoshop for these composites. From my experience I have found that layer order can often wreak havoc. One trick that a retoucher friend of mine gave me a while back was to keep global changes higher in the stack while more local changes get applied towards the bottom of the stack. Here is an example of what I mean;

If you've ever done spot removal or dodging and burning on a separate layer you may have encountered this. You have your original layer and apply a curves adjustment to it. You then do a color adjustment layer and then some spot removal and dodging and burning on top of that. Later on you make some more changes which requires a modification to the lower curves layer. Suddenly every single spot you meticulously worked on removing become obvious brushed blotches on the image. A simple fix is to move the spot removal layer (local adjustment) below the curves layer (global adjustment) and voila, it's fixed.

In your case you have to keep in mind that a slight feathering to your masks will have a short transition between 100% effect to 0% effect (black to white). That transition through the grays is what causes the haloing and will react differently depending on the effect applied above or below that layer. In many cases it can be easily corrected by simply moving a layer up or down or by shifting the mask edge to compensate.

Hope this may be of help.


Thanks for the info Duck !!! I was not aware of that and I will have to experiment with your suggestion as I'm a hands on type of person and will not fully understand the process until I see the results. You have given me, and hopefully others, a valuable tip. Much appreciate !!!
Dave
http://www.davechinn.com/

Don’t shoot what it looks like. Shoot what it feels like.
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Post by St3v3M » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:11 am

davechinn wrote:After posting an image of a sunset with a leading fence line, I decided the image needed just a little bit more in the scene. I had various subjects in mind but some were not as appropriate for the environment. My main problem is I'm torn between color and B&W (sepia in this case) so I'll have you decide, but that may not help me with a decision, either way I'm happy with both.
Dave

I'll 'accept' this as a single image even though there's something about the cowboy's face, the eyes maybe, that give it away, but you have to remove the cow. S-
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Post by davechinn » Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:50 am

Thanks Steve !!! I have a revised version and I thought I had posted it, but I see I haven't. I'll post the revised version and yes, the cow, which is a horse has been removed, but a different horse in its place.
Dave
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Don’t shoot what it looks like. Shoot what it feels like.
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Post by St3v3M » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:35 pm

davechinn wrote:Thanks Steve !!! I have a revised version and I thought I had posted it, but I see I haven't. I'll post the revised version and yes, the cow, which is a horse has been removed, but a different horse in its place.
Dave

I look forward to it! S-
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Post by davechinn » Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:07 am

Thanks again Steve !!! The revised version has been posted. viewtopic.php?f=89&t=2811
Dave
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Post by St3v3M » Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:36 pm

davechinn wrote:Thanks again Steve !!! The revised version has been posted. viewtopic.php?f=89&t=2811
Dave

Excellent! S-
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Post by davechinn » Wed Sep 13, 2017 3:03 pm

Thanks Steve !!!
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